Is there a way to require the PSK to expire?
What exactly do you mean? A kind of expiration timer that automatically blocks the VPN if the same PSK is used for x days? This must be a firewall feature, but I have not heard of a feature like that.
Or do you mean whether it is a security issue if the PSK is never changed? Well, as long as both sites use static IPs, and as long as the PSK is complex enough, there is no reason to change the PSK. However, if it is never changed, this is not “good” either. Maybe it is exposed through another way (social engineering, etc.). So, in my opinion, a PSK change every 3-5 years is a good choice. But even more it is relevant to check every 3-5 years if appropriate security algorithms (ciphers) are used for phase 1 and phase 2. If you are still using “no-DH” or “DH-2”, this is NOT secure anymore.
That is: Change your PSK every 3-5 years AND review your P1 and P2 proposals. ;)
Hello,
What do you mean by “Generate a new PSK for every VPN tunnel”? Do the communicating parties need to exchange a nonce/random everytime (with which they generate a new PSK)?
See AlsoWhat is a pre-shared key or shared secret?Where do I find my WEP key or WPA/WPA2 preshared key/passphrase?Find my IPsec pre shared keypre-shared keyImagine that we have several embedded devices that they need to authenticate whenever they want to communicate with each other. Do you think that authentication with PSK is a good idea ? Do you know of any mechanism with which we can securely distribute the PSK to all these devices? Or should we configure the PSK seperately on each device?
Thanks
Well, it depends. If you have multiple embedded devices, you should consider using authentication via certificates. There are options to distribute certificates automatically.
Concerning “Generate a new PSK for every VPN tunnel”: If you are a company that has 10-50 static VPN tunnels that do not change that often (i.e., the IP addresses of the partners do not change that ofen), you can use PSKs for authentication. The PSK must be configured only once (!) during the setup of the VPN. It must not be changed later on.
But if you have a few VPNs coming from dynamic IP addresses, I do not recommend to use the same PSK for these VPNs, but to use a different/new PSK for each of these. If one PSK is exposed, it can be deleted without the need for a change of the PSKs from the other VPNs.
Where should l get IP adress
You might like the IPSec PSK generator I wrote. It allows two parties to securely generate a PSK without having either party transmit it to the other party.
https://www.ifm.net.nz/cookbooks/IPSec-Pre-shared-Key-PSK-Generator.html
So instead of worrying if a third party might know your PSK, you definately know a third party knows it [you]?
:P
Can you speak to the plausibility of an attack on a main-mode Phase 1 Internet Key Exchange IF the attacker can snoop on the traffic and if s/he ALSO knows the pre-shared key?
I’m thinking that in thinking that in main-mode, If one were 100% certain that your IP address were not being spoofed by an attacker (impossible, I know, but this is a thought experiment), that absolutely NO phase 1 key would be needed at all, is that right? The Diffie Hellman key exchange itself guarantees that the key is exchanged privately. The key, as you say, is only used for validating the identity of the remote parties.
Hey Karlfife.
I am not sure whether I am understanding your question correctly. You’re asking about a passive attacker that 1) has the PSK and 2) is only listening but NO man-in-the-middle, correct?If so, he is NOT able to read anything in plain text because of Diffie-Hellman. You’re assumption is correct. DH guarantees a secure key exchange. (To be correct, it is a “key agreement” rather than a “key exchange” since both parties have their input rather than one party transmitting the key). However, DH does NOT authenticate the peers. That’s what the PSK is used for.
Hence in theory, if no one spoofes your IP connection you can simply trust in your connection (as authentication) and must not use any PSK. However, I would definitely NOT suggest that! ;)
Can you speak to the plausibility of an attack on a main-mode Phase 1 Internet Key Exchange IF the attacker can snoop on the traffic and if s/he ALSO knows the pre-shared key?
I’m thinking that in thinking that in main-mode, If one were 100% certain that your IP address were not being spoofed by an attacker (impossible, I know, but this is a thought experiment), that absolutely NO phase 1 key would be needed at all, is that right? The Diffie Hellman key exchange itself guarantees that the key is exchanged privately. The key, as you say, is only used for validating the identity of the remote parties.
Yes, AFAIK, this is correct. If you are (in theory) 100 % certain, that your IP as well as the IP address from the other side are *not* spoofed then you can make the PSK public. ;) Indeed, Diffie Hellman is used to generate the session keys.
Tanks for
I never have understood the difference between ike and isakmp .why it is used interchangeably .What i have seen in wireshark 6 main + 3(2) quick all are exchnaged using isakmp only .User data is encrypted with ESP protocol .So my question where do we see ike ?????
Hey Deepak. To be honest: I am always a little bit confused about these namings here. That’s why IPsec VPNs are a little difficult to establish, since there are that many different things and namings and synonyms to remember.
As far as I know, the IKE definition uses the ISAKMP protocol for some of its parts. The main protocol used is indeed ISAKMP. That’s why it is dissected as “isakmp” within Wireshark. I don’t know why it is called IKE anyway and not ISAKMP directly…
